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ApplianceGuru.com: The Samurai Appliance Repair Forums > Do-It-Yourself Appliance Repair Help > The Kitchen Appliance Repair Forum > Problems with GE Profile (PDS18SBMLBS) Defrost
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ApplianceGuru.com: The Samurai Appliance Repair Forums > Do-It-Yourself Appliance Repair Help > The Kitchen Appliance Repair Forum > Problems with GE Profile (PDS18SBMLBS) Defrost |
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| Problems with GE Profile (PDS18SBMLBS) Defrost | Rate Topic |
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 02:10 pm |
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1st Post |
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pmh4514 Grasshopper
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Greetings! I have a GE Profile (PDS18SBMLBS) freezer on bottom. The defrost has not been working, I've had to open it and use a heat gun every few days to keep the fridge cold. First of course I figured the defrost timer switch was bad. I checked it with a multimeter and proved it was bad. The contacts were all corroded. I picked up a new one, and grabbed a new defrost thermostat as well figuring I'd probably return it. The new timer works, I tested and verified the cycle and switching. Still the heating element does not heat up. The heating element shows 25 ohms when tested for continuity. The defrost thermostat itself failed, looks like the rubber seal came undone somewhere along the line, and it was entirely rusted out inside. So I replaced that as well thinking for sure it would work. I show 25V between the heater leads when not in defrost cycle, and 118V across the leads when in defrost cycle. I allowed the new thermostat to freeze and let the switch run through its cycle. still no heat. The heating element is just a metal spring inside a glass case though. I see no corrosion or breaks (though there was some moisture inside the glass tube.) I've hesitated to replace that as it's a $100 part and doesn't look to be bad, though I'm no pro. But what else could it be? I was surprised that both the switch and thermostat failed more or less at the same time but they did, proven with a multimeter and obviously corroded upon visual inspection. There is no motherboard on this model. Any thoughts? Could the heating element be bad despite it not looking corroded, having no breaks and showing 25 ohms across the ends?
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 02:40 pm |
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2nd Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology 
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pmh4514 wrote: .. I show 25V between the heater leads when not in defrost cycle, and 118V across the leads when in defrost cycle. ...Volatge measurements should always be made with the device connected, unless otherwise specified ...
____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 02:45 pm |
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3rd Post |
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pmh4514 Grasshopper
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RegUS_PatOff wrote: pmh4514 wrote:.. I show 25V between the heater leads when not in defrost cycle, and 118V across the leads when in defrost cycle. ...Volatge measurements should always be made with the device connected, unless otherwise specified ... Right, I just wanted to be sure power was coming through up to the heating element. When the heating element was connected, I did not get 118V between the leads - this was prior to installation of the new thermostat. I will allow things to refreeze now and manually enter defrost cycle, then re-test between the leads with the heating element connected, and the thermostat frozen over. But wouldn't my continuity reading on the heating element show that it is functional? In what other ways could the heating element go bad? thank you for your reply
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 02:49 pm |
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4th Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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The Heating Element is probably functional, but the supply voltage source could be defective...
____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 03:06 pm |
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5th Post |
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pmh4514 Grasshopper
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supply voltage source? is this a part I could replace? Why would the leads show the voltage change from 24V to 118V when the defrost switch was engaged if the problem was "before" the heating element? (bear with me, I'm no expert here!)
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 03:13 pm |
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6th Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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pmh4514 wrote: supply voltage source? is this a part I could replace? Why would the leads show the voltage change from 24V to 118V when the defrost switch was engaged if the problem was "before" the heating element? ... I can't find a wiring diagram for that model, yet... Volatge measurements must be made with the device connected (to eliminate a source voltage problem) It could be a bad connection somewhere, not letting the source voltage through ..
____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 03:16 pm |
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7th Post |
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pmh4514 Grasshopper
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Hmm. Forgive my ignorance on the matter but I'm confused. If the voltage is making it all the way up to the connectors for the heating element, wouldn't that imply that whatever is "sourcing" the voltage to the leads was working? I'll have access again in about an hour, things should be frozen, I'll try to probe the leads with everything in place.
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 05:05 pm |
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8th Post |
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pmh4514 Grasshopper
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update - everything is connected and frozen up. You said to test with everything connected. Just for reference though, with the heating element NOT in place and cooling on, I see 7.5V between the ends of the leads. Cooling off (defrost on) I see it jump to 47V. When I plug the heating element back into the leads (as it should be tested), keeping my meter on the same two points, the voltage drops to zero. final edit - I took the heating element out and ran 120V across it, it heats up as it should.. so.. must be a wiring problem somewhere ?? Last edited on Mon Jun 29th, 2009 05:21 pm by pmh4514 |
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 05:45 pm |
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9th Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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pmh4514 wrote: ... so.. must be a wiring problem somewhere ?? yes ... I'll try to find some info ..
____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 06:06 pm |
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10th Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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With everything connected, and while in the Defrost mode (you can turn the Defrost Timer) Check the voltage from each of the Heater Terminals to chassis (ground)
____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 06:10 pm |
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11th Post |
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pmh4514 Grasshopper
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thanks again for your time. I won't be able to run the test you suggest until later tonight (back at work now..) where on chassis is ok to test? I would assume the metal pan below the cooling coils (to which the thermostat is thermocoupled) would not be appropriate? Everything else seems to be plastic though. By the way, when I do open things up how long would it take for the thermostat to "warm up" to the point where it could be creating false readings for me? that is, defrost mode on but not running the heater because the thermostat isn't cold enough. Anyway, I'll report back with the voltage between heater terminals and chassis, but that won't be until later on tonight. What "should" it be?
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 06:13 pm |
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12th Post |
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pmh4514 Grasshopper
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(ASIDE - interesting that when I type 'PDS18SBMLBS WIRING DIAGRAM' into Google, this very thread shows up.. as the only search result!)
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 06:23 pm |
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13th Post |
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pmh4514 Grasshopper
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I have also just called GE and requested a wiring diagram for this model. They said it will take 48hrs though. If you don't find anything in that time, I'll post the PDF they do end up sending me.
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 07:11 pm |
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14th Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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chassis = any unpainted metal that would (should) be connected to the Earth Ground. Readings should be 120v. Defrost Thermostat may be 28F to 58F This may be a similar digram Attachment: Page from 31-9108 2.png (Downloaded 32 times)
____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 07:28 pm |
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15th Post |
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pmh4514 Grasshopper
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Thanks for the image. I'll report back later with the test results. Do you know what the circled 3 and 4 refer to on that diagram? I have no ice-maker, and all lights and fans are working. The compressor is working properly as well. Could it be the relay?
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 07:31 pm |
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16th Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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3 & 4 are test points.. The Relay (upper right corner) controls the Compressor The Defrost Timer controls the Heater
____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 07:39 pm |
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17th Post |
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pmh4514 Grasshopper
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Thanks. I'm just trying to decipher from the schematic where a problem point might be. Would 3 and 4 be the points of connection between the wires and the heating element? edit: perhaps the 'temperature control' is malfunctioning? Last edited on Mon Jun 29th, 2009 07:40 pm by pmh4514 |
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 07:57 pm |
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18th Post |
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RegUS_PatOff Fellow, Academy of Sublime Masters of Appliantology
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3 & 4 could be anywhere .. If the Temperature Control wasn't working, niether would the Compressor (when not in Defrost) When you replaced the Defrost Timer, did you use a universal Timer where you had to connect a Black Wire ? Last edited on Mon Jun 29th, 2009 07:59 pm by RegUS_PatOff ____________________ RegUS_PatOff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPAY2LsKVEw my video production: “Easter Seals Walk With Me” (also in HQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EBiLyYXMiA Upon leaving this Earth "Do you want the Smoking or Non-Smoking section ?" |
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 08:02 pm |
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19th Post |
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pmh4514 Grasshopper
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The replacement timer was a little plastic box with 4 posts coming out of it. The replacement was exactly like the old one in every detail and simply plugged in where the old one came off. There was no additional wiring involved.
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| Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 09:37 pm |
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20th Post |
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pmh4514 Grasshopper
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well my friend, I'm at a loss now. I just went to do the tests as you described. I manually switched into defrost mode and when I went to insert my probes, this time the heater turned orange and when the coils were cleared of ice, it turned itself off then about 10mins later the timer turned the cooling cycle back on. very strange.. I'm at a loss why it wasn't working earlier except maybe I was wrong in my assumption that the thermostat was actually frozen at the time. thank you so much for taking the time you did. I'll post back if it seems to stop working again.
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