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- > Do-It-Yourself Appliance Repair Help > The Kitchen Appliance Repair Forum > GE Nautilus won't drain - checking power to solenoid

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GE Nautilus won't drain - checking power to solenoid  Rating:  Rating
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 Posted: Wed Nov 12th, 2008 11:24 pm
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deltamike
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It's a GE Nautilus GSD4100J00WW, and the pump whales away but the water won't go.  I checked you marvelously informative GE Drainology page - I cleaned the rear plunger valve and the flapper valve but they weren't too gooky.  I unplugged the solenoid and I'm seeing 34 ohms across the contacts.  I'd like to see if there is power going to the solenoid in the drain cycle.  Right now the dishwasher is disconnected from the power, drain and water supply, and is sitting on its back in the middle of the kitchen.  Can I plug it in, and cycle the timer to see if the solenoid goes off without damaging anything?  My thanks.

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 Posted: Wed Nov 12th, 2008 11:37 pm
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deltamike
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Hang on, my buddy just did it and he's alive.  The solenoid appears to work with great enthusiasm.  Maybe the one way plunger valve was the problem after all.  Is there anything else I should check while its all apart before I put it all back together and see if it works now?  I'm a little concerned that the thing actually pumped water out onto the floor for us to see a problem - I thought there was a float switch to shut the water off if it got too full.  I'll look for posts on that, too.  Thanks.

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 Posted: Thu Nov 13th, 2008 12:56 am
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deltamike
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OK, I tried to run it after cleaning the plunger valve and flapper and checking the solenoid.  It starts to pump water out when the solenoid clicks but then sort of wimps out.  I can open up the door and see the sprayer was working, kind of like the solenoid valve wasn't closing all the way.  I wired the plunger valve shut, just to make sure it wasn't leaking (it was clean, but a little ratty)  No joy.  It will pump a little water out when the solenoid clicks, but won't empty the dishwasher.  Can I get to the solenoid drain valve to check if that is the problem?

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 Posted: Fri Nov 14th, 2008 02:21 pm
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deltamike
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I have the pump and motor off and I have a question.  When the solenoid pulls the lever to close off the pump chamber to the sprayer and open the drain, it doesn't pull the valve all the way shut.  It leaves it open a bit.  The valve will close all the way, but it has to work against a separate spring-loaded lever.  It looks like the water pressure of the pump serves to close the valve all the way.  I can't figure out what purpose this serves.  Can someone explain?

It could be that if the motor or pump isn't developing enough pressure to close the valve, water will never exit the drain but will continue to circulate through the dishwasher like it does in the washing cycle.  Which are my symptoms.  So do I have a bad pump/motor?

I'm attaching a picture of the valve in the partially closed position.  I'm holding the lever at the position the solenoid would pull it.

Thanks

 

Attachment: 3Closed.jpg (Downloaded 35 times)

Last edited on Fri Nov 14th, 2008 02:21 pm by deltamike

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 Posted: Sat Nov 15th, 2008 03:44 pm
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deltamike
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I need help figuring out if it is the motor or just the impeller.  I got the macerator blade off but can't figure out how to get the plastic screen off to look at the impeller.  I'd hate to buy a new motor if it is just the impeller.  I know I'll get a new screen with the impeller kit, but I don't want to damage the pump housing getting the old one out.  Can somebody help?

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 Posted: Sun Nov 16th, 2008 07:41 am
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Budget Appliance Repair
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The screen is right hand threads to remove, (opposite of normal to remove).

If you have a square shank screwdriver they work very well to remove the screen, you should have four nubs sticking up on the face of the screen that the square shank of the screwdriver will grab and turn very nicely.



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William Burk (Willie)
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 Posted: Sun Nov 16th, 2008 11:06 am
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deltamike
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Excellent, things are really starting to come apart now!  Thank you.   I had already tightened the thing up a quarter turn before I gave up and posted the note for help, so I had to pound on the nubs a little to get it going the other way, but it came right off.  The spacer and metal ring look good the impeller looks good, and the motor runs smooth and quiet.  Now I'm beginning to think it is the drain valve gasket.  It's the black rubber D-shaped gasket attached to the underside of the nylon gate valve.  When the valve is pulled by the solenoid, it doesn't close all the way.  This appears to be by design.  Water pressure from the pump will push the valve closed all the way and water will then exit the drain.  Only on mine it looks like the gasket is worn or warped, and doesn't ever completely seal.  I don't know how to get the gasket off without tearing the pump apart, and I don't know if it is a replacement part anyway.  Will I need to replace the whole pump?

 

Thanks again,

Duncan McBride

Attachment: Dishwasher 002.JPG (Downloaded 24 times)

Last edited on Sun Nov 16th, 2008 11:11 am by deltamike

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 Posted: Mon Nov 17th, 2008 07:07 am
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Budget Appliance Repair
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The drain flapper and gasket are part of the pump body, if that is really the problem then you must purchase the pump body and reassembly using all old part, (I would suggest replacing the impeller and seal kit while you have it apart if you decide to replace the pump body).

You might want to price the complete pump, much easier and all new for maybe not that much more.

The drain flap and spring work just as you you think they do and about the only thing that can cause what you're experiencing is a bad flap gasket, serverly damaged impeller, or a slow running motor, (I've only seen a slow running motor once and it was because the impeller seals were stuck together not letting the motor turn up to speed.  Usually when the seal stick the motor won't run at all and you have to just give the fan blades a little turn to break the sticking seal loose).

When the machine calls for drain the solenoid pulls the flapper arm down to the about 3/4 closed position which is as far as the solenoid pulls.  Then the pressure of the water against the flapper gate pushes it closed the rest of the way and keeps it closed until the water is to low to make anough pressure to hold the gate closed.  This takes the load off the solenoid and also after the drain has been initiated the power to the solenoid can be turned off to prevent the solenoid from overheating and melting down, (this is another somewhat common thing to see on GE dishwashers - melted/stuck drain solenoid).

From your picture the flapper gasket doesn't really look like anything is wrong with it, but possibly at the flat edge looks a little warped.  Does it look like it seals and flatens out if you take the springs off and close it by hand?



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William Burk (Willie)
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 Posted: Mon Nov 17th, 2008 12:47 pm
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deltamike
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In the picture it doesn't look so bad, but the flat edge of the gasket will not fully seal unless I push the lever pretty hard.   The unwarped portion of the gasket has to deform quite a bit for the warped section to contact the seat.  Not only  is it warped, but the rubber has worn away and has become stiff with age.  I don't think there would be enough pressure to completely close the valve.   Can I just buy the pump body and impeller?  I went through the parts list and it looks like all that is available is the motor/pump combo. 

 

Thanks for your help!

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 Posted: Tue Nov 18th, 2008 09:55 am
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Budget Appliance Repair
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Here's the complete new motor kit:  WD26X10013 $129.90
http://www.repairclinic.com/referral.asp?R=154&N=820985

The impeller & seal kit only: WD19X10032 $26.40
http://www.repairclinic.com/referral.asp?R=154&N=907946

You have the newer style pump already in your dishwasher.  I don't don't know if just the body is available on that style or not, (I think it is, but can't find a motor parts breakdown to get a part#).   I know the old style pump body was able to be purchased by itself.

Maybe someone else can help in finding a complete motor/pump parts breakdown?

Have you tried to hold the drain flapper down by hand when it was trying to drain to see if it would drain by holding it all the way closed instead of relaying on the water pressure to keep the drain gate closed?

Last edited on Tue Nov 18th, 2008 09:59 am by Budget Appliance Repair



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William Burk (Willie)
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 Posted: Wed Nov 19th, 2008 12:24 am
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deltamike
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I believe the impeller is ok, since there is plenty of pressure to run the spraybar - I'm ordering the whole pump and motor.  Thanks for all your help. 

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